Adriana Zanetti, Director Of Manufacturing Operations at Fresenius Medical Care North America

Adriana Zanetti is an accomplished leader with extensive experience in the medical device industry, particularly in supply chain and manufacturing. With a career spanning several decades, Adriana has held a variety of key roles, including Production Engineer, Planning Manager, Director of Supply Chain, and Director of Manufacturing. Her expertise lies in overseeing complex supply chain operations, ensuring compliance with stringent regulatory requirements, and driving operational excellence in manufacturing environments.

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Nikhil: Welcome to another episode of Growth Unplugged. I'm your host, Nikhil Joshi, and today we are honored to have Adriana Zanetti join us. Adriana is a seasoned leader in the supply chain, particularly with many years having spent in the medical device industry. Welcome, Adriana.  

Adriana: Thank you, Nikhil. Thank you for having me. 

Nikhil: Yeah, it's good to have you. Adriana, tell us a little bit about where you're based out of and what do you do. 

Adriana: As you well said, I spent most of my career in the medical industry. I hold a lot of roles in my career and I started in manufacturing. I fall in love. I was in the production area, done a brief time during my early career. 

I was in engineering as well, and then I landed in the supply chain. And that's where I fall in love. I started as a planner, then a junior planner, a planning manager. And then as a director for supply chain and later in my career, I was spending some time also as a director of the manufacturing for medical devices. 

So I did a little bit of everything so far.  

Nikhil: Awesome. When I think of medical device industry, I just think of hearing aids. Or some complex system that a doctor is going to use for our listeners. If you had to introduce the industry, could you give us a short pitch here?  

Adriana: It's a little bit, as you say, is of course, they're all devices, things that people use in their houses. 

My expertise or my experiences on products that are used. In a clinical setting, which is in the hospital or in a clinic, because he's on the dialysis. But we do this possible for dialysis for patients. Of course, regulatory and thinking always have the patient you have to. Do both is what the nurses need, but also what the patient is going to experience. 

Right? So engineering, of course, is the one that design all the gadgets and everything. But for manufacturing, you always have to keep in mind what is the nurse experience and what's going to be the patient. So quality is 1 of the most important things availability of the supply and the quality, of course, because it's the patient lives. which is what you're dealing with.  

Nikhil: I keep hearing always whenever I read a little bit about medical device industry, this word compliance keeps coming up a lot. Documentation, it seems like there's a lot that happens in the industry. But could you tell us why is it so important? Why is it so particularly important in the medical device industry? 

Because I don't see that much maybe in a food or in a toy industry  

Adriana: Yeah, especially in the U. S. The regulation is very stringent. We have the FDA and it's different levels depending on what product you're selling, but any device, any level you're going to have to comply with all the regulation. You have to have FDA approval and of course, they had the protocols that what needs to be there and even basics, what is called is the good manufacturing practices. Yes, you have to have the documentations. You have to have all the testing, all the clinical trials and during the manufacturing, we have to keep record of pretty much everything from qualifying vendors. You have to do testing when they give you the samples. 

You have to keep track of how you tested the sample. Let's say you gonna qualify a new resume. You want to buy from a different vendor for whatever reason. Uh, and believe me, it is all the time. It seems to be one common denominator because with this. World of changing, you constantly have to certify based on the regulations. 

You have to make sure that where this product is coming from what contains that you tested in your product that is going to meet all your specifications and you're going to test it on the field as well. To ensure long, it's going to last, let's say it's a plastic and you may relate with this with the toy industry. 

Something is a plastic. Right? So it sounds like it's just plastic. It doesn't disintegrate. We know that leave forever. But guess what? No, it can break. Right? Let's say. The nurse is going to connect it and happens that this plastic ages not well, so when you're going to use it, it's going to crack, and the cracking is going to create a leak, maybe. 

Let's say, imagine an IV set that you're going to the hospital, and they're dripping on you, and you're sick, and one of these components, Breaks and now you're bleeding so that kind of things. So it is important regulation is important. Ofcourse, I remember in an incident where we wanted to qualify a different resin and. 

It wasn't as good as what we had, but nevertheless, what we had was discontinued. You have to choose something. People have this aversion of risk. We're dealing with, okay, how many pounds can withstand? Oh, it's going to be 60 pounds. Let's say, do you really need 60 pounds? A person can only apply 15 to give you an idea. 

Right? So, regulation is important and compliance is important, but you also need to be able to be. Something repetitive, competing, how much do you need? And I remember we having a discussion at work that one of the guys was saying, if a forklift roll over this part, it's going to break, but is that realistic? 

You don't need this part to be rolled over by a forklift and then still work because you are in a clinic. Environment, what you're going to have is people managing with a hand, not with any metal things that is going to break it. So, yes, as I say, regulation is important, but you also have to have realistic settings. 

And when you said your standard, you have to set it in what the application of the product is going to be. 

Nikhil: Yeah, I've seen doctors, if they found, let's say a syringe or something just open, they would just throw it. Oh, correct. Yes. Going over that is definitely going to be replaced with something brand new. 

But in summary, what you're trying to say is that everything in the medical device industry affects human life and because it affects human life. That extra care is what compliance and regulation brings to the product from a safety standpoint. Would that be a fair summary? Correct. Interesting. If that's the thing, in medical device industry today and with all the experience that you have had, what are some of the challenges that you're seeing today? 

Adriana: As I just mentioned, availability of parts is a challenge because, yes, medical devices, you think is an endless supply is something that the world needs and it's always there, but guess what, at the end, companies need to make money. So you find in your environment that some companies just closed down and let's say you only qualify one vendor and they shut down. 

Or the machine is just aging and it's not cost effective for them to replace it. They're just going to shut it down. It happened to us in the past. So that is pretty much the challenge. Also, other things is the globalization. How weather nowadays is huge. Like, to give you an idea, when the tsunami happened in Japan, We got affected because, yeah, we were buying, it wasn't us, but one of our supplier was buying precisely from that town, and it was a unique component that they were manufacturing in that one of the towns next to where the tsunami happened in Japan, and the government shut down the whole, pretty much the whole area, right? 

No matter what you say, our patients are going to die, but guess what? They can, because they have all these massive issues that is not like, you can resolve it within the week or 2. so we invest a lot of time on having 2 supplies and especially. In a different geographic location, because every year. In the last 10 years, I would say we have earthquakes. 

We have floating when Houston at that time got floated. That also affected the plastic industry because a lot of companies had to shut down. So those are mainly the challenges is the supply chain. Which you have to be smart enough to have enough supply on hand, having several vendors qualified that they can give you where they have, or you can have 1 vendor, but if they have manufacturing locations and different areas, geographically, some in America, some in Europe, some in Asia, then you're covered because that way. 

If the U. S. have an issue, then you can bring it, even if it costs more, but at least you have the supply in the medical industry, right? Because as I say, you sustain life. So it's not, Oh, because it's expensive, I'm not going to produce it. You have to.  

Nikhil: Yeah. It's interesting how you describe all the risks that is associated, even if it is not you, but if it is your supplier, I really liked what you shared in terms of. 

Climate tech and climate is becoming a real reason to become a problem anywhere in the world. It could affect. I think some of the high schoolers and millennials that I always talk to today when they go and they want a job, they want a sense of purpose. Right? So it's very interesting that you say that if we are building medical products that somebody needs here in the US, yeah, And if climate can basically spoil the whole manufacturing here, I can attach a sense of purpose, right? 

To that. If I'm making sure that we can produce the goods here in the U. S. very well and take care of the supply chain risks, then I think we are doing a good service. To humanity and people around us. That's a huge purpose. That's awesome. If that's the case, I want you to help me break some myths, right? 

Since we're talking of high schoolers and millennials, you guys as leaders, you and I, at one point of time, we were in high school and we were getting into the factories, et cetera, but I somehow think there's a huge myth. Around medical device factories, people sometimes think it's still packing boxes or it's just maybe assembly line. 

How is it? Can you describe the medical device manufacturing and some of the systems that you work? Is it as simple and monotonous or is it a complex place to live in?  

Adriana: It's interesting because one time I had, um, face to face, get together with young people and they were impressed that I spent so many years in the same place and they were like, Oh, my God, I just can't picture myself young people. 

Right? And we were young. I was young too. And of course, I never imagined myself to be able to spend. So many years in 1 place, but I think that's why I fall in love with the supply chain world and the manufacturing because yes, it is the same place. So I just mentioned whether there's constant challenges. 

So, that's what keep us alive. Yeah, we don't want a monotonous life. I think. Young people, what their fear is to be bored, pretty much, it's not I want to be changing, but it's they want to be changing because they want to be learning different things every year, growing as a person. And honestly, I find manufacturing to be a place that you can learn endlessly. 

Because there's challenges almost every day. As I say, the tsunami affects you, the weather affects you, if they shut down the port. During the pandemic, you might remember they closed down some of the most important ports in the world. So guess what? Now you're facing a different challenge. It is the same, but it's not the same because the challenge is making fun or sometimes you're going to face shortage of personnel. 

So, now you have to make do with less people during the turn of the millennium, during the year 2020. That was a maybe you were too young to remember, but there was a big crisis that people thought that they're going to be like nowadays that people fear of a digital shutting down, right? Like, what are we going to do if we have no systems at that time? 

That's what happens. A lot of time was invested on how we're going to overcome if this happens. So you end up learning a lot of things different. As I say, every year the world changes. In the world, make it a different challenge and you learn as a young person, you can find multiple hats. And that's how you continue to learn. 

Nikhil: I think there are many industry sectors where career cycles are becoming shorter. And I think what you're sharing here, manufacturing probably, I think is. still one of those industries where if you want to leverage your experience of your initial years and then build upon that and move around and still continue to take on challenging work. 

I think you have proved that from your example of your experience, but I think that's still very much prevalent in our industry. And it's probably true that it's only the manufacturing is. In the industry right now, which has that vast opportunity of that kind. In fact, with everything coming, a lot of reshoring to reduce supply chain risks and a lot of manufacturing coming back to the Americas that also basically showcases in the same direction. 

So I want to change gears here that challenges, they were there, they are there today, and they're also going to remain. In the future, and the big change I see in every industry is the adoption of technology, the adoption of digital transformation systems, et cetera, tell us a little bit about your experience with manufacturing systems and the processes that you worked with in the medical device industry. 

Adriana: Yeah, I started with when things were super manual, right? So I've been part of this transformation and it's incredible. You need them, definitely. And especially in the medical industry, I think any industry, even in our day to day, you need the digital and all the communication platforms. And of course, for a regular industry, it's something that makes your life easier. 

It's less costly because you have to keep records of what you use, how much you use that sort of things. Then systems are necessary. We use different platform. I love is a SAP is a very good system. Of course. A lot of people don't like it because it's very rigid, but in a regulated industry, you need something like that. 

You want something that is not as flexible as you would want to, because you need those records to be perfect. Other industries, you may need the flexibility. I've been in other type of industries where you want to have the ability to change the system as you go, because every day changes. Then you want that. 

As I say in the medical, you don't want that, but in others, like in the cosmetic industry that I've been in the last years, then yes, you want to be able to change your system and adapted to these different customer and you want the people to have the access to modify.  

Nikhil: Okay. And just for all our listeners, I think you were talking about ERP in general as one of the digital. 

Could you share what are other tools or digital tools that generally a medical industry uses other than an ERP, which is an enterprise resource planning system?  

Adriana: You need to have your ERP system. Definitely. That is. Like your main frame name from there, you're going to have systems that going to control your day to day activities, for example, for the manufacturing. 

How much do you make? What's the plan was? And then you're going to have another system, which is the planning capacity. For example, you're going to have a software or sometimes they're homemade. Spreadsheets or some databases that you're going to use for your capacity for your machines and then you have the HR systems where you have all the employees records for training and all that it'd be a global thing that many areas fitting to one to have a good planning and to have a good process moving. 

Nikhil: If you see, I've always been curious to ask this, right? If you look at a young guy out of college or a girl out of college, but they come into the shop floor, one of the myths is that they probably had to go and do things on paper, people using their phones, et cetera. Everything is becoming digitalized. 

Is that still the case? Or is that a myth where you have to go work with these 20, 30 year old processes or all these systems that you're speaking about, essentially. Laying the foundation that you won't see paper in the factory, but it is more about how do you use these systems and work towards business outcomes? 

What's the situation with medical device industry? 

Adriana: You're going to have both again, it's about money, how much money the company in this, so you're going to have processes that are old. And they continue to use legacy systems, and you may need to have a signature, let's say, but then you're going to have others where you're going to have this platform. 

No, you're going to have to enter digitally everything or scan it. People. can have the iPads on the shop floor to record things. So yeah, you have a combination. And I think one of the key elements in to be successful is, I'll call it, there's two things. One, you have to be flexible. Definitely, and that applies for everybody, right? 

Even in a marriage, anybody that is a rigid, guess what? Still want to work? Relationship. Let's not talk about marriage because that's all the things that young people are not doing. But again, even in a relationship, you have to be flexible. You have to be able to adapt. So flexibility is one thing. And then, Another key element, which may sound counterintuitive, because especially for industry, I noticed people are averse to risk. 

And I think one of the key elements to be successful is to be able to take risks, calculated risks, of course, but you have to be comfortable with some unresolved risk. And yet you're going to have to move on. You spend the time with your research, But when you have to apply something, you're never going to have zero risk, because, hey, that applies to everything in life. 

There's risks on everything, and you have to be able to manage it. And then once you face your risk, you move on, or you actually discover that, guess what? I made a mistake, and this risk was not a risk. Now it really is. is an issue, you move on. Nothing is as catastrophic as you can imagine. So for young people, worry about making the wrong decision, because guess what? 

You can always change, right? There's very few instances that they're going to be catastrophic or you're going to get fired. Most of the times, honestly, I see people get fired or not being promoted. It's because they're not aggressive enough or proactive enough.  

Nikhil: I see that. I definitely agree on that. 

Somebody had said that if you're shown the door, or if you went and resigned, and if the management just accepted your resignation, then know that you were an overpaid liability. 

Yeah, I thought that was a good quote, but I think you raised some interesting points. You being a manufacturing leader, is the business in the medical device industry kind of changing from the way it was before? Is the customer changing? Let's start there.  

Adriana: I will say yes and no. Humans have we changed? We really know our basic functions. 

We don't get much of grades at all, right? Our kidneys are the same. I guess the only thing changing is people are more aware of what they're doing. Their body and people, especially nowadays, young people, they're more health conscious than what we were in the past, right? We're more aware in with the communication. 

Now, people pay more attention to what they eat and all that in the health industry. I would say it's not moving as fast as it should. Which is much of the complaint, right? But why? Because precisely you have to have the compliance and changing processes is not as fast as we would like to. It should actually, because with this competitive industry, and with the cost going to the roof, as we know, that's 1 of our major problems now, but that's precisely because of the risk. 

Managing risk costs money. Why the doctors, for example, charge so much money and we complain? Well, guess what? They have to carry an insurance. Why? Because people sue them. So, at the end, I charge you, I don't know, a hundred bucks or two hundred bucks for, you know, for the consultation, but a hundred goes to the insurance. 

It's just like with a car. Why? Because you have to be covered. Unfortunately, but that's the reality because we as people, more and more, want less risk. We want to be very well treated by doctors. We want to be healthy and we blame on them if we're not. So, sure. That costs money, right? Going back to the risk that as, as humans, I think we're really going to have to be comfortable with risk if we want to not survive because we want to survive, but if we want to have a life, which is more cost effective, one of the challenges that young people are facing now is how expensive things are. 

Why? Because we're not comfortable with risks and we want everything for sure. And sure things cost money.  

Nikhil: In your experience, is technology an answer, at least to some extent, to reduce the cost, or in your experience, is there any other answer other than technology that also leaders like yourselves are doing today, the same thing other leaders could be thinking or looking at? 

Adriana: Technology definitely is key. What technology brought us is communication, right? What used to be something that we had to spend a long time going to a library and research book after book and book after book. Nowadays, it's with our phone, with Google, with everything. It's right away, you have a lot more information. 

But how we're going to discern which one is real and which one is not, that's the key element. So, I would say technology helps. Unfortunately, a lot of people are putting out their things just because they want likes or because they want to be viral. They spread false information. And that's what's ruining this whole thing, right? 

Because now, people just, what do I listen? Do I listen to my doctor or do I listen to what my friends say or what online, what people are talking about?  

Nikhil: Yeah. I was joking with a friend of mine that every six months there's a weight loss study comes that this is not good and in another six months the exact opposite study comes up and it leaves us confused and I think you shared a very important point that essentially is Increasing the risk and therefore the cost and that needs to be controlled technology can really play a key role. 

Let's talk about data, right? I think when we talk technology, I think it's at a very 30, 000 feet level, right? But when we really go into the weeds, it's, if there was data that was available to say, Hey, here is where you don't really have a risk. Just the way you had given the analogy previously as to a plastic part, a forklift is going to roll over that. 

The probability of that is basically very less. And if you had data that, hey, it doesn't really happen, then do you think that data collection and data insights could pretty much be a key player in the medical device Reduce those cost of risks that today we calculate as part of our risk costing.  

Adriana: No, definitely, because also with AI nowadays, you can have, you can take massive amount of data [00:26:00] and analyze it very fast without the human fear. 

That is as scared as we are of the AI, as at least the old generation. I think one part which This is the good and evil, but the good part of the is they just don't have the fear that we have where we put our glasses. For past experiences, no matter what, and you're going to filter all that. Through that lens, and it needs just the human nature. 

You can't help it. And it is what keep us safe in many cases, but it's also like you and I, we're not the same, right? Because you're going to be more scared of certain things, depending on your experience. And then I'm going to be scared of other things. And then some people are extremely scared. care. Like if I think about my mother, her childhood, whatever, she's super scared of a lot of things. 

So if I use a person like that to filter data and make decisions on product based, then forget it. It's gonna be expensive. But a I will give us a real glimpse. How often is that gonna happen? And it can give us an impartial opinion of what should we go, right? So if we're smart enough to use it in that way, This is going to help tremendously to become more competitive because one of the things U. 

1. is lacking is the competitiveness. So if we're talking about nearshoring, it's a very important moment to be competitive. 

Nikhil: Awesome. Have you used ChatGPT, Adriana?  

Adriana: Yes, I did, actually. But I did it for a personal reason only. When I was planning a trip to go to Italy, and I was not sure what to do, where to go, and I was impressed. 

Oh my god, he planned my trip. Tell me where to go, told me how, if it was cheaper to go by train or by car, how much my accommodation is, I couldn't even believe it. And at first I said, but is this for one person or for the three? It was three of us. No, it's three and it gave me this, disclosed the whole cost. 

And I was just like shocked. Things that I never thought, for example, told. I was thinking that, oh, renting a car is always better than a train, right? Because, especially if it's simple. But no, guess what? I didn't even know you pay toll. AI told me, no, you're gonna have to pay for gas, the toll, the parking. 

Oh, my God. It's incredible. It's incredible. What was gonna take me days in manual calculation, did it in seconds. So, no, definitely, it's good. 

Nikhil: You touched the cutting edge, bleeding edge technology, AI, the world that we live in right now. And I tell you, it's just growing leaps and bound every day. But what does that mean? 

Let's change gears and talk about manufacturing leaders, right? A lot of them are in your boat where they have so much experience. And a lot of them are actually being given responsibilities now. to transform their businesses, be it on the manufacturing side or be it on the supply chain side or just overall from what you have seen the industry to be before and what you're seeing it now to what it could be. 

What is your advice to two or three things that you think manufacturing leaders today Should be doing or learning. 

Adriana: It's interesting. We're in a very key moment in history. I guess every time it's like that, but right now it's, it's the transformation. And I suppose as before the leaders, we focus on the manufacturer ability of things and how close you are from your customers and more now is about cost. 

How cheap things are because we want things very cheap. And very fast, basically, and that's what the Amazon of life did to us. Right? It used to be that you order things online and they take a week or two, but with these two days or even hours to get there, now we train the population that things can be done within hours. 

And why not? Basically, We have to focus on that. Things need to be there fast, and things need to be cheap. That's all. 

Nikhil: Presume this is without, like, quality is not even in question. It always has to be world class, because  

Adriana: That's a given. Definitely. Yeah, it used to be. You're right, and maybe we can consider that too, as your quality. 

But unfortunately, when we buy things, And, of course, that doesn't apply to the medical industry, right? You're going to focus on what works and patient safety. But I'm talking on the overall industry, that the speed and the cost. But even medical industry, we're being beat by companies in Asia that are cheaper. 

And FDA is giving clearance to those companies as well. So as much as we want to focus on the quality, which is. It really is, but then you have to, as I say, talking about risk again, you're competing and yeah, you may say, maybe your quality is a 100 and this company are at 70, but guess what? Because it's 50 percent cheaper, your customer is going to go there knowing the risk, but guess what? 

I cannot afford it. Because also young people, they may not have the medical insurance that they used to be. Things are not covered as much. Some people work on their own. They don't have medical insurance. So all that kind of thing is changing. So we continue to be challenged with the cost and say, we're going to have to be more comfortable with risk. 

We're really going to have to learn to be more comfortable with risk. Thank you.  

Nikhil: Cost optimization or efficiency and speed is what you're talking about is should be the focus of leaders. Amazing. If, think about a high schooler today, right? What would you tell him to attract him to the medical device industry, manufacturing? 

What should he be learning or what should he be Like, what are your thoughts in that area, Adriana? 

Adriana: If I were to think about when I was young, what did I do? Honestly, if you want to pursue a career in manufacturing or in anywhere, you're going to have opportunity to learn a lot of things, learn the basics. 

Don't be scared of a very lower level position because. As hard as it may be, even if you have to do some boring job, like data entry and all that, those, I call that, because I remember my early years, I called that like kindergarten and first grade, what you learn in first grade, which is like learning to read, right? 

How boring is learning to read? But guess what? If you don't know how to read, you can't do anything in the world. All those jobs, Which may be task oriented at the beginning of your career, those are going to be your equivalency to multiplication tables. You're reading, you're writing for professional life. 

And you're going to find yourself going back over and over to those time, and you're going to take that reading, learning, and multiply that knowledge into so many areas that you cannot even imagine. So, my advice would be, don't be afraid of boring, task oriented job, because it's at least the first three years of your career. 

In fact, you should have those jobs because I found in my career, I found people that skip that they started at a higher level position and guess what? You're never going to find the time later on to go back and learn those. And those will be gaps. There will be gaps in your knowledge that you're going to find yourself that will make you prone to mistakes precisely because you don't have those particular knowledge. 

I would say that. 

Nikhil: I love that. Kindergarten. And pre kindergarten, so the vocational training that every high schooler should probably take, whether they take a carpentry class or whether they go and learn how basically a car is being produced or any sort of vocational skills or just how to operate a machine. 

I think you tied that up very well. That is your pre kindergarten and kindergarten. 

Adriana: No, and everything works. To give you an idea, when I was A little girl. My father used to have bees at home. We had the honey, right? Producing the honey and I learned all that counts because somehow you're going to find that knowledge of that process, the process of extracting the honey somewhere along the line. 

You're going to use that knowledge in another application, and that'd be another key thing, like, consider anything you learn in life or anything you learn in school, you should apply it to your life, and you should be able to apply it at work. The sewing, because you're going to have fine machines that work like a sewing machine, for example. 

It's just endless. Anything in the world. It's connected and everything you learn, you're going to find a way to apply it and you should try it because that's another thing I find people just think that if they didn't teach me in the school, then I don't know it. But guess what? In life, there's a way to apply that to Adriana. 

Nikhil: If you went back to when you are 22. Where you were to get hired for the first time, degree, et cetera. What would you have done differently? Like from whatever you did that time, but now that you know that the needs are different, I'm looking for advice basically to undergrad students now, but more from your experience that if you had to go back in time and change things from your perspective and experience, what would you do differently? 

Adriana: I would say I personally would take more risks. Women in general, and believe me, I'm part of this gender situation that we women fight about, especially in the manufacturing environment. Believe me, women, we face bigger challenges. It's a real thing and we should not concentrate on. Oh, poor me being a victim, but, but rather learn from the opposite sex, what make them successful. 

And something I found from my male counterparts that I admire is one, men take more risks. Two, you don't have to know 100 percent of a new position to be able to apply. I want to make sure I'm 100 percent in control of. What's gonna happen, but guess what men if they have 40 percent they just go ahead and do it Yeah, they may fail, but they try a lot more times than we do So if I were to change something I've been more adventurous because as much as I'm happy For my career and in the level I attain I think I could have done more if I had been more aggressive towards that 

Nikhil: you're reminding me of the time when I started my company when I was just 22 out of college. 

So thank you for sharing that, that that's what you would have done because in hindsight, and by accident, that's what I ended up doing. So that's superb. Adriana, this has been an amazing conversation. Thank you so much for all your insights. To all our listeners, I'll leave you with a question. Medical device industry, the biggest challenge. 

is that you need to manage risk, but that is also the biggest opportunity that is available to everybody out there. And how can you improve speed? How can you improve efficiency? And at the same time, manage all that risk. This is Adriana sharing all her experience. as a leader. Thank you once again, Adriana. 

And to all our listeners, stay tuned for yet another episode off growth unplugged.